Inputs: Timing Chain
#1
10-14-2016, 10:17 PM
Inputs: Timing Chain
2008 F150 5.4L
Parked my truck when i started it up, i heard a popped noise then i turned it off, so i crank it again and couldn't start. I got out my truck and check and saw a drip of oil and i open my hood and saw this.
I'm new to trucks, what am i facing here, any input could help
Thanks
Parked my truck when i started it up, i heard a popped noise then i turned it off, so i crank it again and couldn't start. I got out my truck and check and saw a drip of oil and i open my hood and saw this.
I'm new to trucks, what am i facing here, any input could help
Thanks
#3
10-15-2016, 10:26 AM
Welcome to the site..
Certainly would need to be pulled apart to see the extent of the fail, more so, timing ( doesn't look good there) and debris that may have dropped into the pan. Suspended metals in an oil sample etc.
Front timing cover will need to be removed, evaluation done. If out if time, chances increase for valve issues. And like Hanky mentioned, if high mileage, possibly a used engine or a long block may be an option. If the mileage isn't high, and depending on the evaluation, timing components and head work. Might be worth re chaining it and running a comp test prior to digging deeper..
Depending on your ability, tools available, something you feel you want to take on? If so, we can provide you with the technical instructions.
Certainly would need to be pulled apart to see the extent of the fail, more so, timing ( doesn't look good there) and debris that may have dropped into the pan. Suspended metals in an oil sample etc.
Front timing cover will need to be removed, evaluation done. If out if time, chances increase for valve issues. And like Hanky mentioned, if high mileage, possibly a used engine or a long block may be an option. If the mileage isn't high, and depending on the evaluation, timing components and head work. Might be worth re chaining it and running a comp test prior to digging deeper..
Depending on your ability, tools available, something you feel you want to take on? If so, we can provide you with the technical instructions.
#5
10-15-2016, 12:24 PM
Being either it would be a repair, or, the engine would come out, not much extra work to pull the front timing cover as part of the removal direction.
It certainly doesn't look good, but if it didn't loose timing, it could still be a partial repair. All depends on the evaluation.
If its finished,, and if you can find a lower mileage used engine, it may be a quicker swap over a replacement/rebuilt long block. Generally less expensive as well. Some shops are apprehensive installing used engines because of quality questions, unknown mileage, or warranty issues.
A used engine from a quality dismantler, mileage taken/ reported, documented compression test, and a decent warranty period, or if it can be test run (whitnessed/ vid etc) not as much risk.
I've installed many used from our local yard/s, different make/models, a good portion of the time I see it run prior to it being donor pulled.
Depending on the trucks overall condition, (?) may be worth a reman long block. Certainly less risk, cost is more in most cases because of the need to swap parts from the OE to the engine being built up. Does come with a longer warranty thou. Generally, if the truck is only to be driven a few more years, or sooner than later traded/sold off a used engine can be more cost affective.
Transmission original? Manual/Auto?
It certainly doesn't look good, but if it didn't loose timing, it could still be a partial repair. All depends on the evaluation.
If its finished,, and if you can find a lower mileage used engine, it may be a quicker swap over a replacement/rebuilt long block. Generally less expensive as well. Some shops are apprehensive installing used engines because of quality questions, unknown mileage, or warranty issues.
A used engine from a quality dismantler, mileage taken/ reported, documented compression test, and a decent warranty period, or if it can be test run (whitnessed/ vid etc) not as much risk.
I've installed many used from our local yard/s, different make/models, a good portion of the time I see it run prior to it being donor pulled.
Depending on the trucks overall condition, (?) may be worth a reman long block. Certainly less risk, cost is more in most cases because of the need to swap parts from the OE to the engine being built up. Does come with a longer warranty thou. Generally, if the truck is only to be driven a few more years, or sooner than later traded/sold off a used engine can be more cost affective.
Transmission original? Manual/Auto?
#7
10-15-2016, 01:01 PM
Welcome to the site..
Certainly would need to be pulled apart to see the extent of the fail, more so, timing ( doesn't look good there) and debris that may have dropped into the pan. Suspended metals in an oil sample etc.
Front timing cover will need to be removed, evaluation done. If out if time, chances increase for valve issues. And like Hanky mentioned, if high mileage, possibly a used engine or a long block may be an option. If the mileage isn't high, and depending on the evaluation, timing components and head work. Might be worth re chaining it and running a comp test prior to digging deeper..
Depending on your ability, tools available, something you feel you want to take on? If so, we can provide you with the technical instructions.
Certainly would need to be pulled apart to see the extent of the fail, more so, timing ( doesn't look good there) and debris that may have dropped into the pan. Suspended metals in an oil sample etc.
Front timing cover will need to be removed, evaluation done. If out if time, chances increase for valve issues. And like Hanky mentioned, if high mileage, possibly a used engine or a long block may be an option. If the mileage isn't high, and depending on the evaluation, timing components and head work. Might be worth re chaining it and running a comp test prior to digging deeper..
Depending on your ability, tools available, something you feel you want to take on? If so, we can provide you with the technical instructions.
It depends what the shop will tell me, if the cost is close to the value of the truck.. I would park it home and mess with it...can you PM some instructions
#8
10-15-2016, 01:28 PM
Have any larger dismantler/s in your area.?
Some will rack their driveline components, some leave them in the donors 'intact'. I like the later since mileage can usually be verified, test run to check for a good smooth runner in most cases. I'm also usually more comfortable removing a power plant from a collision involved vehicle over one that appears to be ' run out' or not cared for. Even with a supplied comp test.
The shop you took it to may some suggestions if it proves out that you need a replacement. Most have history on prior used swaps and vendors they used. Could always piece yours back together as well. Labor costs to swap, can sometimes offset more involved in frame repairs. May just depend on the shop, and the deal struck. Shop job costs, and what's actually needed on your OE as a comparison. For me, it would/may depend on my plans for my truck, availability of used, price to repair, and of course a new long block.
Long block is a complete block and heads assembly, remanufactured. If the plan was to keep the truck another 100kish, I'd be prone to go new/ reman. More so if a lower mileage used can't be sourced.
At 185k trans may come into the picture too at some point. Going used on a motor can help with the sting of a trans repair at some point as well.
Some will rack their driveline components, some leave them in the donors 'intact'. I like the later since mileage can usually be verified, test run to check for a good smooth runner in most cases. I'm also usually more comfortable removing a power plant from a collision involved vehicle over one that appears to be ' run out' or not cared for. Even with a supplied comp test.
The shop you took it to may some suggestions if it proves out that you need a replacement. Most have history on prior used swaps and vendors they used. Could always piece yours back together as well. Labor costs to swap, can sometimes offset more involved in frame repairs. May just depend on the shop, and the deal struck. Shop job costs, and what's actually needed on your OE as a comparison. For me, it would/may depend on my plans for my truck, availability of used, price to repair, and of course a new long block.
Long block is a complete block and heads assembly, remanufactured. If the plan was to keep the truck another 100kish, I'd be prone to go new/ reman. More so if a lower mileage used can't be sourced.
At 185k trans may come into the picture too at some point. Going used on a motor can help with the sting of a trans repair at some point as well.
#10
10-17-2016, 11:20 PM
Not to rain on the parade...
According to the shop manual, the 4.6L & 5.4L engines are interference engines
In the timing section, this is what it says:
CAUTION: Do not rotate either the crankshaft or the camshafts when the timing chains are removed and the cylinder heads are installed. Severe piston and valve damage will occur.
So the question is...How far did the engine rotate after the timing chain broke, and was any valve/piston damage incurred?
According to the shop manual, the 4.6L & 5.4L engines are interference engines
In the timing section, this is what it says:
CAUTION: Do not rotate either the crankshaft or the camshafts when the timing chains are removed and the cylinder heads are installed. Severe piston and valve damage will occur.
So the question is...How far did the engine rotate after the timing chain broke, and was any valve/piston damage incurred?