Hello all. I am, unfortunately, no longer feeling very confident in the recommendations I am getting from my "experienced" friends. Each of them is giving me a different answer and their reasoning/explainations dont sound very logical. I am totally aware that I may be wrong and one of them could be right but I dont have any funds to waste on more parts that only make the situation worse. Any suggestions/advice you could provide would be greatly appreciated. As I am unsure which issues are related I will try to include everything. Vehicle is a 1990 F250 XLT Lariant with a manual transmission. Months ago, every once in awhile she would decide not to start. When the key was turned, it sounded as if she was trying but didnt have enough power. Each consecutive attempt would sound like the engine was cranking slower and slower, as if the battery was dying and each time it had less and less power to give. The frequency of this happening steadily increased. I discovered that most of the time, if I waited between 6 to 10 minutes and tried again, it would start. It seemed as if the battery was recharging itself and needed at least 6 minutes to get enough juice to crank over. If I tried before the 6 minute mark, the timer would start all over again. I have been told that that is not how vehicle batteries work but that is how it seemed. If I stalled the truck or ran out of fuel ( the clutch is inconsistent, been told that it is going out and the fuel gauge doesnt work so it took awhile to get familiar with how many miles she would go per gallon ) 100% of the time, even though it was just running along perfectly, every single time it would not start and I would be stuck in the middle of an intersection with people honking and yelling ( like Im stopped in the middle of the road for the fun of it ). It progressed until it was happening multiple time a day everyday. We made sure the cables were tight and the corrosion removed but the general concensous was that I needed to buy a new battery but didnt have the money to do so. I was making a U turn one day and she stalled as I was coming out of the U. Of course, it wouldnt start and had died directly in front of the gated driveway of a place which was near the airport. It creating a situation where nobody could get in or out of the lot. I am begging her to start as I am so embarrassed at this point, I look up and see a man wearing a uniform and carrying a rifle, walking toward me. I wasnt stuck in front of an airport building, I was blocking all access into and out of the National Guard base. After 15 minutes she still wouldnt start and a nice guy offered to give it a jump. We lifted the hood and found out why it didnt start. It appeared as if the battery connector had melted. Replaced the connectors, adjusted the timing, replaced the battery, and installed a new used alternator. The problem remained after each change but after replacing the battery, the 6 minutes trick stopped working. Also somewhere along the line it became necessary to speed pump the fuel peddle while turning the key also when I turn my blinker on the charge guage on the dash starts moving back and forth. Sometimes using a jumper box works, sometimes it doesnt. Sometimes getting a jumpstart from another vehicle works, sometimes it doesnt. It has refused to start even after trying to jump it with multiple vehicles, jumper boxes, and letting it sit and I had to call a tow truck to get it home. I went into autozone today and this nice young gentleman brought a machine out and attached it to the battery then had me start the truck. I am not sure how but somehow this machine attached only to the battery is supposed to be able to test the battery, altermator and starter. It said fail for the starter and he said it referenced the RPM's. I asked if a bad connection to the starter could possibly create the same readings and he just repeated that it said the starter was bad. I am puzzled by this as I dont believe that jump starting would work if the starter was bad and Im pretty sure that the guage moving problem is caused from some kind of grounding issue, right? I cant afford to go out and purchase a new starter to continue getting stranded daily, if it is obvoius that the starter isnt the cause of the problem. I just dont have the knowledge necessary to decide if a bad starter would behave this way.

 

It sounds like bad wiring than a bad starter. If I were you I would start cleaning (using contact cleaner) just the starter solenoid (attached to the starter). If that didn't help, just remove all wires/cables attached to the solenoid, clean them with wire brush if needed. And start tracing the wiring backward from the starter back to the battery, clean every single joints (including clutch interlock relay).

 

First; battery has to be checked and capable of accepting and holding a charge.
Then charging system needs to be checked for required output.
Cleaning the battery cable ends is good, but we need to check if the battery cables are not internally corroded which can result in high resistance to charging and also power output when needed. This only takes a little work and not a lot of $$$. Internally corroded cables need to be replaced almost impossible to clean internally.

 

Thank you. Everytime I asked about the wiring they would all look at me like I should sit down and look pretty and let them handle the hard stuff that requires thinking LOL or they would just ignore that I said anything at all. 🤦🏻‍♀️.

I believe in this year the solenoid is attached to the inside of the frame above the passenger tire, which will make getting to it to clean much easier. Before I start spraying or brushing should I remove the cables from the battery? Not sure if it can shock me or short something out if I do it while it is attached to power. When you say to clean every joint, does that mean everywhere that the wires don’t have insulation? I will have to google what a clutch interlock relay is.

 

thank you for your reply. The battery is only about two months old. I have put a multimeter to it and it shows fully charged, in fact on a couple occasions when she wouldn’t start, I tested it with the multimeter again. Even though it sounded like the battery was dead and wouldn’t start, on those two occasions the battery still came back showing between 12.5-12.8 ( sorry I don’t recall the exact number). I’m not sure if there are other tests I should be doing to check it? Can you explain how I will be able to tell if the cables are internally corroded? Is it just the battery cables that do it?

 

On auto tranny there is range sensor, it sits between the ignition switch and the starter relay, note this is just the trigger wire. On manual, clutch interlock relay. If your van has security system, then it sits between the trigger wire. The battery cable to the starter doesn't go thru the clutch interlock relay.
Like hanky mentioned about internally corroded that's something you have to use your DMM's ohm meter to check for resistance, closer to zero better. The visible connectors end, those are the ones you use contact cleaner or wire brush to clean. Of course you can also take shortcuts and just use ohm meter. BTW you can also do a quick check if the negative is short to power, and the positive is short to ground, all using your ohm meter, just checking continuity and it beeps doesn't do any good, you need to get the ohm.
Since your battery is relatively new, that's why my previous post I suggested you to go backward, instead of checking from your battery to the starter solenoid, you start from the solenoid. Should be 3 wires on the solenoid, one is the B+ connects to your battery, one is solenoid to the starter motor, the last one is the trigger wire. Some trigger wires are soldered onto the solenoid, then just use contact cleaner and clean, and check with your ohm meter. The B+ you can remove the nut then the cable and clean. Yes, you need to disconnect BOTH battery cables.
Please also note that everytime when the wiring is bad like in your situation, in summer time you can have hard time starting, or a warm start. In winter time you can start it up much easier, the difference is hot temperature = higher resistance. The lower resistance to the wire/cable, the better.

 

A little reminder,
If only one strand of wire makes the connection a voltmeter will read what ever voltage is at the battery COMPLETELY UNRELIABLE.
Item #2. Same with an ohmmeter reading,no resistance there reads zero, BUT THE ONE STRAND NO WAY CAN CARRY THE AMPERAGE REQUIRED, so those methods are not reliable.
Using a voltmeter, doing voltage drop testing with the circuit UNDER LOAD , which means attempting to operate while measurement is taken is the preferred method.
There are several videos demonstrating the procedure, worth checking.